Tax the Rich, Save Democracy: The Truth They Don’t Want You to Know
We are told that if we tax the rich, that jobs will disappear. That prosperity will dry up. But the numbers tell a different story. In the latest Gaslit Nation, Amber Wallin, executive director of the State Revenue Alliance, joins Andrea to expose the lie at the heart of our economic system. The rich are not fleeing. They are flourishing. And when we make them pay their fair share, everyone flourishes.
Wallin comes armed with data and clarity. She dismantles the disinformation that has allowed the ultra-wealthy to hoard billions while public schools crumble and hospitals close. States that tax high-income earners are not bleeding millionaires. They are gaining revenue and creating more millionaires. They are investing in their people. They are proving what we already know deep down: we can tax the rich and build a society that works for everyone.
The Battle Behind the Budget
For decades, tax policy in America has been a weapon wielded against working people. It has been shaped by lobbyists, shielded by myths, and sold to the public as necessary sacrifice. But history shows us something else. It shows how tax codes have been intentionally designed to protect wealth at the top and starve communities at the bottom.
Wallin makes it clear. We are not fighting numbers. We are fighting a system that tells us scarcity is natural while billionaires pay less in taxes than teachers.
Tax Justice Is Democracy in Action
Economic inequality is a threat to democracy. When wealth concentrates, power concentrates. And when power concentrates, freedom erodes. That is why taxing the rich is not a fringe idea. It is a democratic emergency.
Wallin also emphasizes something often ignored in these conversations: gender equity. Women, especially women of color, are hit hardest by unfair tax systems. Correcting that is not just about fairness. It is about building systems that’s humane.
No One Is Coming to Save Us. We Are the Movement.
This conversation is a call to action. States hold tremendous power to reshape the economy. Community organizing, public pressure, and clear messaging can push forward tax reforms that fund schools, roads, housing, and healthcare. Essential services are not luxuries. They are rights. And the money to pay for them exists.
The only question is whether we have the courage to demand it.
Wallin says it best: free markets are not free. They are designed by and for the wealthy, unless we intervene. Tax policy is not boring. It’s political warfare. And the sooner we treat it that way, the sooner we win.
We are in a moment of extraordinary possibility. Trust your instincts. Trust the data. And above all, trust the power of the people to build wealth and power for everyone.
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Andrea Chalupa (01:05):
Welcome to Gaslit Nation. I am your host, Andrea Chalupa, a journalist and filmmaker and the writer and producer of the journalistic thriller, Mr. Jones, about Stalin's genocide famine in Ukraine. The film the Kremlin doesn't want you to see. So be sure to watch it. Today we're joined by Amber Wallen. Is that how we say your name? I forgot to ask.
Amber Wallin (01:26):
It is yes. Thanks for asking. Yes.
Andrea Chalupa (01:28):
Today we're joined by Amber Wallen, executive director of the State Revenue Alliance. Amber is here to unpack brand new data released in collaboration with the Institute for Policy Studies showing that states that tax high income earners are actually seeing an expansion, not a flight of wealth and millionaires. So Amber, you're saying that we can tax the rich?
Amber Wallin (01:58):
I'm absolutely saying that, Andrea, because what the data shows is that especially in a time right now when we know that so many Americans are frustrated and being harmed by rampant wealth inequality and a big rising gap between wealth of folks at the very top and then the average paycheck that Americans bring in, what we're seeing is that those states that have actually taken steps to tax the ultra wealthy not only have not seen those rich folks leave the state, but that wealth continues to grow in the state. The number of very rich folks in the state continues to grow. And so we know that those fears have been overblown. And if we look at what the data shows taxing really wealthy folks at a higher rate, which we know is not just something that will bring in more money, but it's actually more fair and it right sizes our tax codes, that that's also bringing in lots of revenue for these states and that wealth continues to grow.
Andrea Chalupa (02:59):
And which states are doing this?
Amber Wallin (03:02):
So the states that we looked at in our report, we looked at four states. So we looked at Massachusetts, Washington, and then we also looked at New York and Rhode Island. And the reason that we looked, especially at Massachusetts and Washington is because both of those states have in recent years enacted taxes on ultra wealthy earners. So they are a great test case for what that looks like. And now there's data, new data available to look at, well, what did that do in Massachusetts? What did that do and Washington? And so I think the most important thing that we saw is that two years into Massachusetts taxing of millionaires, and that was passed in the Fair Share Amendment in 2022, that actually the millionaires grew in Massachusetts by 39%. The number of millionaires in Massachusetts grew by 39%. And the wealth that those millionaires hold grew by more than 580 billion.
(04:05):
So again, taxing those ultra wealthy in Massachusetts, it didn't cause them to flee. What it did cause and what we're seeing is that not only did it right size that state tax code a little bit, but it also provided critical revenues for programs like childcare and higher education that's being put towards university scholarships. It's being put towards school meals for young children and really necessary road and rail system repairs. And then in Washington, we saw pretty similar things. So the number of millionaires in Washington grew by almost 47%. Their wealth grew by over 700 billion between 2022 when they taxed, when they put some additional taxes on capital gains or income that comes from holding wealth. So just in two years, they saw enormous benefits for their state. And again, there's always that cry that if we tax rich folks, oh, they're going to leave and what will we do then? Well, I think there's a lot of things we could do then, but what this shows is that what we know we will do is that we'll bring in essential revenues for our states that can provide critical services that all communities and families need and that everybody in the state benefits from.
Andrea Chalupa (05:25):
What would you say to Fox News, especially in an election year, blasting to everybody, especially their Hispanic viewership in states like Florida, where there are many diaspora communities that escaped governments that were communist and totally dysfunctional dictatorships and that you could say US foreign policy. Sure, but they have trauma. And so when they hear socialism, communism, they become more aligned with the Republicans. And Republicans have done an extremely good job in dominating a state like Florida for that reason. That's not the only reason, but it's a contributing factor. So what do you have to say about accusations that this is socialism and you're trying to punish the success of the millionaires and the high income earners?
Amber Wallin (06:24):
Yeah, that's a great question. Well, I think we start by reframing that view of what this does. And not to get too wonky, but if we look back at basically the last 70 years of tax policy in the United States, and there's fascinating data out there that shows, just puts it into lines that can show where tax breaks have gone overwhelmingly and overwhelmingly, they have gone to the very richest earners in our country at the federal, state and local levels. Those are the groups who have overwhelmingly gotten the big tax cuts. The big tax breaks benefited from cost shifts onto regular middle class working families onto low income workers, onto young folks. And so I think that idea about, well, this is going after folks, I think the right way to think about it is this is right sizing and balancing our tax codes. This is an attempt to get that back from folks who used to pay a lot more, but because they have outsized power and influence have been able to skew the tax system to benefit them, we see that and the impacts of that are not just for those wealthy folks, it's for the rest of us.
(07:35):
It's for all of our communities in all of our states. Because what we know is if you're cutting taxes majorly for high income earners, well states in the federal government still have bills to pay because we still have schools to support and firefighters to support, and we still have roads to build. We still have national parks, we still have public safety, we still have libraries, we still have teachers and classrooms and all of those things that government helps support for everybody. And so what that has meant is that costs have been shifted onto everyday working families. And so we've seen sales taxes increase across the country. We've seen other costs go up to pay for those tax breaks. And of course we're seeing that obviously right now play out on a major and very present way in Washington DC with the federal reconciliation and budget and tax bills happening. So that's the reality. The reality is all the tax breaks true history have overwhelmingly gone to higher earners. And so when we're taxing wealthy folks a tiny bit more, because that's really what we're talking about, we're not only building essential resources for programs that benefit multiple generations of folks. I gave those Massachusetts examples. That's what they're spending the money on, school meals, university scholarships, childcare, improving infrastructure. Those are things that benefit everybody. And it's just a tiny step back towards taxing those folks at a fair and more equitable rate.
Andrea Chalupa (09:09):
So as we're recording this, one of the big markets and the influencer industry is the trad wife, the mystique of the trad wife, all these glittery women who show domestic goddesses, baking things, crafting things, all the things I don't have the coordination or the time to do, but it's just this MAGA subculture where they very much want to put women back into the home, into the kitchen with their giant diamond crosses around their necks. And it's just this horrible pressure they're putting on women. And along with that, they're threatening our right to vote and so on. But what's really funny about that is, listen guys, we can't afford to be single income households anymore. Look at the price of living and look at how the poor working class, as you're pointing out, are bearing the brunt of these tax breaks for their super rich and plus this idealized past of the 1950s that this whole trad wife internet culture is glamorizing, comes from a very different era with a very different tax code.
(10:25):
When you could afford to have one spouse stay at home, you could afford to buy a house then and you could afford to pay off the mortgage and you can send your kid to a well-funded public school. So could you speak a little bit about what the tax code was like back then? Obviously we don't want to go back to the fifties. It was a time of Jim Crow, like what we're grappling with today, but even worse. But could you speak just about the taxes during this time? It was very different before the Reagan revolution.
Amber Wallin (10:55):
Yeah, that's such a great point and I really appreciate that historical tie because back then you're exactly right. There was much more coming, much more money coming into our tax code from very high income earners. And so what that meant was that there was more money coming into our coffers and there was more money to support essential programs and services that everybody needs and uses that we all benefit from. And part of the result of that was that folks were able to make better incomes. When you look at how income has risen for most folks over the decades for middle income and low income families, it has not risen nearly at the pace as wealth has grown for the ultra wealthy, I think back in the day there was the opportunity for families to more easily exist on a single income. And you're absolutely right that part of the reason that that's no longer the case is because we have given away so much money in tax breaks to very big corporations to the ultra wealthy in our communities.
(12:00):
And then when you look at how that impacts, I just appreciate the gender equity point that you brought up because the reality is that it is women and families and children across the country who tend to suffer the most when the programs that matter most for our communities are underfunded. And we're seeing that happen right now as you outlined. So not only do, if you think about tax policies and who they disproportionately benefit, they disproportionately benefit older, wealthier, wider folks who tend to be disproportionately higher proportions of men who benefit from those. And then when you look at more fair and progressive tax policies, the folks who tend to benefit a little bit more of that, right? Right-sizing our families, our low and middle income earners, our children. And so we know that there's a very deep gender equity element in these taxes that we're passing and that we're seeing, you referenced what it was like in the fifties.
(13:04):
And we just keep seeing that happen again. And we're seeing that happening right now coming out of DC that we're seeing a prioritization from a Republican trifecta in Congress and the presidency passing tax cuts, four millionaires and billionaires and paying for it by cutting Medicaid, cutting food assistance, cutting essential government programs and cost shifting to the states. And we know that real families and communities will be harmed by all of these things, but we know that who's going to benefit, it's going to benefit the ultra wealthy who's going to suffer the most. It's likely going to be low income women, families and children. And so yeah, I think there's a big gender equity element in how we're creating real opportunities for women to make the choices that they need and want to make and that they know are best for their families. And what we're doing right now, what we've historically done are not it.
Andrea Chalupa (14:01):
So in the nature-nurture debate, there's a new study that just hit the press here in the US. So I don't expect you to comment on this study. And I'll link to in the show notes, I just read it this morning in Newsweek, and it's out of a university in Denmark, one of the, excuse me, Denmark, one of the countries in the world with the highest happiness rates, lowest corruption rates, high tax, the rich rates. And this study looked at traits of psych personality disorders, like sort of toxic behaviors of individuals. And what they found was, and it was a global study, they're looking at samples around the world and their focus was on countries that had high levels of corruption and government dysfunction. And they found that those countries tended to have respondents to their study with high toxic traits, personality disorders. And so what they believe, obviously this is just they said that they feel like there's a moderate, there's moderate support to say that societies that are dysfunctional, corrupt, high levels of income inequality, that creates a breeding ground for personality disorders. And it makes sense because people are increasingly vulnerable left on their own. And it is the rules of the jungle that the Republicans like to talk about where Mike makes right, and that you have to have a free market with no regulations, no nanny state overseeing everything and interfering. And it just let the biggest have the laws of the jungle determine the markets.
(15:47):
And as a result, you get people fighting each other for what's left in this sort of starvation state. And that breeds personality dysfunction. And so this Copenhagen study, this Danish study was saying, what our research points to is that we need healthier societies in order to develop healthier people. And that's obvious. That's an obvious one. And Denmark, the existence of Denmark is a strong supporter of that. When I was working on a project based out of Copenhagen, I stayed at the home of, I was working on a film there and the film producer I was working with, I stayed with his father who's this lovely gentleman, a successful businessman, very rich. And he said to me, I enjoy paying my taxes.
Andrea Chalupa (16:33):
My money is developing the most precious natural resource of my country. And that is the minds of its citizens. So I need everyone to be healthy. I need everyone to be happy because that's what makes society happy and healthy. And it's like this is a guy that's a millionaire in Denmark, proud to pay his taxes. And the way they celebrate birthdays in Denmark is you decorate your home by raising the Danish flag. I kid you not, you go to a birthday party in Denmark and the Danish flag is all over the cake, all over the streamers swinging from the front porch. And so your birthday becomes a day of national pride because they're so happy that you were born into their country, into their society, and they treasure you as a part of it. And that's why they pay their damn taxes. And that's why my friend that I was working on this project with got a quarter of a million dollars amber, a quarter of a million dollars to make a short film, a short film, not even a feature film, a short film. The government paid for him to go to film school and then gave him a quarter of a million dollars to make a short film and then paid for the award ceremony to hand him an award for this film. And he's one of the most successful and demand film producers in the world.
(17:54):
And it's just like that's what we're missing out on America, that level of cushy support. It's so nice. That's why they're the one of the happiest countries on this planet is because they're so well taken care of and they're so celebrated. Meanwhile, we in America are facing literal starvation, starvation and mass death under these Republicans. And it's like people need to wake up this conversation. We're having the work that you're doing. This is the very heart of the resistance, is taxing the rich that is going to solve a lot of problems. I am going to hand the mic back to you. This is very essential, this conversation. So I obviously want to go back to you, but I want to just say in all my work and all my decades of setting authoritarianism, there's three ingredients that lead to dictatorship. One is political instability, the other is rampant disinformation propaganda. And the third is massive economic inequality instability. And that's what we're facing now. And it's only going to get worse under Trump's big ugly bill.
Amber Wallin (19:06):
Absolutely. Oh my gosh, I agree with so much of what you said, and I feel like there's two threads of it that I want to tease out a little bit more. I don't know, defer to you where we go, but that connection with democracy and then there's also that connection about what free markets do and who is harmed most when we say, oh no, let's just do our hands off. Let's not care about people in our communities. And so I don't know, maybe we'll take that democracy one first because that just feels so important right now. And we know that often when we think about democracy, and I love hearing your thoughts on it and your international perspective and experiences and wisdom I think are super valuable to think about this because you have that view. But when we think about democracy, we often think about voting rights and access to the ballot, those essential aspects of democracy.
(20:04):
But as corporate power and the influence of the wealthy becomes more prominent in US politics, we know that wealth can actually equal political power and that rising inequality is a core and rising threat to us democracy. The flip side of that, and I'd say, well, we saw that especially on inauguration day, right? We saw how quickly all of these tech companies were willing to change policies to stifle free speech, to funnel money into get their front row seat at the inauguration. And so as we think about big tech and communication and how people get their information that that threat, that all those folks and all those tech billionaire bros want their tax cut harms our democracy, harmed our elections, harms our democracy will continue to harm our people. But we also know that progressive in the same way that tax was part of the reason all those tech bro and comms folks are cowtowing to this frankly dystopian view of what our country might be.
(21:09):
We know that tax is an essential part of also addressing that crisis because tax policy is more than just closing loopholes and raising revenues and improving fairness and equity in our tax codes. We know that it's also really a cornerstone of how we can build wealth for communities, for communities of color, for families, for middle income workers, for women with children. And by doing that, how we restore faith and public programs, you talked about some folks who may have come to our country and have come from authoritarian regimes where things are not working for them, but what we can show through tax and through revenues is that things can work, is that you can get great schools, you can have preschool available for families who want it. You can have paid sick time and paid family medical leave. So mothers and fathers can stay home with their babies.
(21:57):
You can have a university that's available for all. So everybody can go to college and build greater wealth for generations of their folks who come after them. You can have road systems that work well, but we need taxes, we need revenue to do that. And so in a lot of ways, I think tax is a part of that, how we fulfill the dream of democracy. But we are in a real time right now because we know that our courts kind of this last bastion for some of these things that they're a little bit shaky. We know that media truth is sometimes tenuous that folks get so much of their news from, or so maybe I'll say so many folks in our country get their news from outlets that are not truthful, that are spreading misinformation, community members are being disappeared with this federal tax and budget bill, the big beautiful bill, what is really a big, terrible ugly bill making its way through Congress, but that will be the biggest wealth transfer in the history of our country. So the very work of strengthening our democracy and how we do that is really under attack because of what they're doing with tax and budget strategies. So I think you're right in that accountability that how we support our communities, that those things are essential and shouldn't be overlooked is ways that we secure and protect and restore our democracy.
Andrea Chalupa (23:27):
And I think the other thing you wanted to comment on was the Republican favorite. I don't even know if it's a catchphrase, but they just love that image of the market is a jungle, rules of the jungle. It's just horrifying. And it's like actually civilization came out cooperation and us working together and building some boundaries and some rule of law, that's where progress came from. And the renaissance was made possible because of a lot of investment in the arts. And so I wanted to ask you about that because you said that was another thread you're interested in pulling and in relation to also the mythology of trickle down theory, which was just pure, potent Grade A fentanyl-laced gaslighting.
Amber Wallin (24:19):
Yes, 100%. Yeah. I think that idea of free markets, we know that free markets aren't free because wealthy and big corporations have enormous power in free market and capitalist systems. And we know that they have access to policy makers and decision makers in a way that advocates really well for their interests. And so that idea that, no, let's just let it go. How it is you think about who has the chance to influence that system. And we know that the wealthy and corporations and big lobbyists are very powerful in that idea and that dysregulated economy that they have a ton of power. And so what we've seen as a result is overwhelming tax policies that have benefited them directly, that have cut taxes for big corporations, that have allowed for loopholes, that allow for tax dodging, for major corporations that cut taxes for those who make wealth from investments and stocks and bonds, but raise taxes for people who make their income from salaries and from wages like the vast majority of people in our country do.
(25:26):
And so we know that that hands-off system has really harmed people because it's not only made the system unfair, but it has really starved our states and our communities and our families and our budgets of essential revenues for key programs. You mentioned the arts, and that's definitely part of it. It's arts, it's journalism, it's things that support free speech and what makes glorious democracies. And it's also programs that support kids and families and diverse perspectives. When you think about who has the most power, and that's sort of a hands-off idea, it's wealthy and big corporations and who has the least power in that system are kids. And I came to this work from child advocacy at the state level, and back then we did a lot of work on tax actually. And folks would always ask like, wait, you're focusing on child programs? Why are you talking to us about tax?
(26:28):
And that's because for so long we'd make the case like the classrooms need more books, teachers need basic provisions, we need more food in our schools. And again and again, we would hear this kind of platitude, you talked about platitudes. We still hear 'em because lawmakers will say, we love kids, we really love babies, we support teachers. Aren't they so important? Oh my gosh, nurses, yada, yada, yada. But sorry, we just don't have the money to pay for it. But the reason we don't have the money is because they have given away all the tax breaks to all those big corporations, to all the really wealthy. And that has harmed our children. So while we're right now cutting the Republican controlled Congress or putting forth proposals to cut healthcare for millions of Americans to pay for tax cuts, at the same time we're seeing minuscule amounts of our budget go to programs that support kids that support mothers.
(27:32):
Things like childcare, things like schools. And so that idea, again about free markets, we know free markets aren't free, and we know that we need to advocate for children and families and everyday Americans in our country if we want to have a hope of not just creating better opportunities for generations of our families, but also taking back our democracy and sizing it. So we continue to be all to reach that dream of our democracy, I guess is what I'd say, because we've had challenges. But I think there is a brighter vision out there, and communities all across the country right now are getting engaged in taking that back and in building it. And so there is some optimism even during these really tough times.
Andrea Chalupa (28:16):
Absolutely. And the way out of this crisis in America, if you want to stop the next Donald Trump from coming to power, it's tax the rich people they need to feel in their lives, government working. They need to have their childcare paid for. They need to have amazing, efficient hospitals, emergency rooms, healthcare. They need to stop worrying about their water drinking, water killing them. All of these essential services require money and experts and monitoring and innovation. And we need to protect ourselves, especially the most vulnerable black communities, non-white communities from the climate crisis, which is only going to get scarier. And that takes money and that takes taxing the rich. And so I want to ask you also about given Trump's over the top dictator cosplay, I mean he's acting above the law, the fire hose of terror and corruption coming out of this white house. His ice agents emboldened by their commander in chief to be a Gestapo, these masked men just kidnapping people off the street, which makes everyone vulnerable to being kidnapped off the street because there's going to be copycats. They're like, I can get away with that too.
(29:44):
And so the lawlessness of this regime, governor Gavin Newsom, in response, has threatened to withhold federal income tax from his state of California the fourth largest economy in the world. And I'm reading this and going, go Gavin, go. New York State should threaten to do this. Every single so-called Blue State, the primarily democratic voting states, they tend to be the richest states in the union that financially support under taxed poor states like Louisiana, Mike Johnson's, Louisiana that happen to be read, primarily Republican voting. And so I want to ask you, is that a mechanism that exists? Could the rich blue states withhold their tax income to curb the excesses that are run amuck from this administration?
Amber Wallin (30:50):
Yeah, that's a great question, Andrea. I have thought about that a little bit. Not an expert in it, but I will say they could do that. And we've heard rumblings from some different states that are like, well, wait a minute, we are paying for these services. We are paying to be able to have help when we need it. We're paying for all of these essential federal programs that support so many people, but we're being threatened by politics for, we're going to face retribution because of some political infighting that may cause us to lose FEMA relief or emergency disaster relief. Well, why should we pay? So we have heard that from a few states, and that's I think a real conversation because we are in unprecedented times. We are in times where we thought we would never be. I think even if you asked a lot of Republicans just a year ago, would you ever have the president blessing the arrest of democratic senators?
(31:55):
Would you ever have a president who would refuse to call and give condolences when democratic lawmakers were slaughtered getting emotional? Would you ever have a president who blessed arrest of everyday citizens who was arresting judges? All of these things, we would've thought we would've never have gone there. But you can see how much women rely on democratic norms. And then you have somebody who comes in and is willing to go into a lawless place, is willing to put things out there just to push that line to see how far he can go to destroy what he sees as his enemies. But we're not enemies. We're just regular folks. We're regular Americans trying to exist in this experiment that we built 200 years ago and are trying to make the most of and really make everything it could be. But yeah, we have heard that from states, and I think that's a real thing.
(32:48):
That's a real bold strategy in a time where bold pushback is needed. And also I think it points to when we start making choices that are really outside of the democratic norms that have, I say democratic and lowercase d, democratic a democracy. When we depend on norms about how federalism works and how relationships between states and the federal government work, it's important that we do rely on these things that have allowed us to keep going as a democracy for so long. And so I think it's a wild time, but that's something that we're hearing. We're hearing it from not just California, hearing it from a number of states,
Andrea Chalupa (33:25):
Let's go New York. That's my state. So I'm like, yes, withhold our income tax force Trump to get his Gestapo out of New York. And it's a very powerful leash because at the end of the day, MAGA lapdog, Mike Johnson, his Louisiana is what Republicans would call a welfare queen. I know it's a derogatory term, but a lot of their accusations are projection. Alright, any final comments for us here?
Amber Wallin (33:56):
I was just going to say, because you mentioned Louisiana and just to talk about what that, whether or not there is a political divide and where it's coming from. I think on the ground, folks are not nearly as divided as those folks at the top would have us believe. They're all about polarization. They're all about pitting folks against, particularly the Republicans in Congress and the President are really pushing hard to scare people to use scare tactics to gain power. But what we're seeing is folks on the ground, they understand what's happening. And you mentioned Louisiana, so I was just going to say, at the end of Louisiana, in Louisiana in March, there was a big push from Republican lawmakers to push through a constitutional amendment that the amendment itself was longer than the Louisiana Constitution, but basically to cap the state's ability to raise revenue for schools, for teachers, for essential programs.
(34:52):
But it was super confusing. It was a super high priority of Republican leadership there. So they shoved it through, went on the ballot, and they thought they were going to just fail to victory. But instead what happened is that everyday community members showed up and droves in the end of March election, which it's a random time for turnout. They expect a turnout to be very low to help their cause. But instead, Louisianans showed up across political Republicans and Democrats alike showed up to defeat it, to strike it down this major priority because they know, no, we actually want to support our schools. We actually want our kids to be able to go to schools that aren't crumbling. We actually want teachers to be valued. And so I think there's that idea of how we're communicating with folks, how we're listening to folks on the ground and how folks are represented in the political process is a more essential conversation now than ever before with what we're seeing when we can't necessarily rely on federal lawmakers to represent the interest of the people, which they, they're not doing it right now. They're pushing tariffs, they're pushing budget cuts, they're firing thousands of federal workers. They're rounding up immigrants and sometimes citizens alike. There's lawlessness happening. And so I think the more we listen to our communities, the better roll off we'll be.
Andrea Chalupa (36:09):
And what advice do you have for people in their states to go to their state capitals and push for legislation that would tax the rich? What action could our listeners take?
Amber Wallin (36:19):
Yeah, that's a great question. Well, we're seeing it happen. And I think just that question about what folks can do in the States, what we're seeing is the states are kind of the last bastion for protecting our communities. If this big bad bill makes its way out of Congress, we know that 13 people stand to lose their healthcare. We know that at least 2 million children will have their food security assistance cut. We know that Republicans already shut down school meals in a number of places. We know that tens of thousands of federal workers have lost their jobs. And that all of those cost savings are being used to put towards to pay for tax cuts for billionaires and to shift costs onto the states. So we know that state legislatures will be facing enormous pressure to make up the revenue that is being cut by the federal government to raise revenues to ensure that kids can eat, to ensure that folks have healthcare, to ensure that our schools are supported.
(37:16):
And so I think it's a real moment right now in state tax policy and in the state tax movement where communities can raise their voices and tell their lawmakers, not only do I not want to lose my healthcare, but I don't want to see my neighbor lose their healthcare. I don't want our schools to be defunded. I care about our communities. Our children need to eat. And so I think it's time that states state advocates and state community members contact their lawmakers and say, we need you. We need to step up right now. We need you to ensure that the most essential programs for families and communities and multiple generations in our state can have what they need. And the way we do that is ensuring just fair tax policy. It's even, it's not an out there concept. We've seen it. We saw it in Massachusetts, in Washington, we've seen it in New Mexico where I live. We're seeing it in a number of states across the country where state lawmakers are advancing proposals. We just saw the Illinois Governors sign one just this week, that tax big corporations, that tax wealthy individuals, that is the best way that we can ensure that our communities are safe, protected and have the services they need. So there's a real moment happening now. And state houses are where we do that, where we tax the wealthy, where we tax big corporations at a fair rate so that we can ensure our communities have what they need.
Andrea Chalupa (38:46):
And the states, the governor should get together the so-called Blue State Governors, and they should withhold their federal income tax. If Republicans pass this big ugly bill that threatens 2 million children with famine.
(39:05):
I'll go on the record to say that. Let's go.
(39:08):
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